Originally Posted by salus.populi

Since when has all public expenditure needed to recover it's costs?

We are in the midst of an expensive pandemic where every penny counts.
Pandering to a minority which includes myself as a cyclist when there are
people in dire straits is not something my conscience can easily accept.

We have to get value for money from scarce resources and spending on infrastructure projects where the majority benefit has to be the way.

Originally Posted by local

We are in the midst of an expensive pandemic where every penny counts.
Pandering to a minority which includes myself as a cyclist when there are
people in dire straits is not something my conscience can easily accept.

We have to get value for money from scarce resources and spending on infrastructure projects where the majority benefit has to be the way.

This is central government policy and the money is supplied by central government. Our MP should gave checked whose idea it was before upsetting his bosses in the government.

Originally Posted by onehorsetown2

This is central government policy and the money is supplied by central government. Our MP should gave checked whose idea it was before upsetting his bosses in the government.

Our dull MP's complaints were rightly about the proposed schemes and the lack of consultation not the funding.

Originally Posted by local

We are in the midst of an expensive pandemic where every penny counts.
Pandering to a minority which includes myself as a cyclist when there are
people in dire straits is not something my conscience can easily accept.

We have to get value for money from scarce resources and spending on infrastructure projects where the majority benefit has to be the way.

A few cones and bollards is a drop in the ocean compared to the billions being frittered away by the government on contracts for inadequate or non-existent services awarded without any competition.

The public are being robbed blind.

Originally Posted by onehorsetown2

This is central government policy and the money is supplied by central government. Our MP should gave checked whose idea it was before upsetting his bosses in the government.

its irrelevant who is paying....its the damage to our town centre that is the problem...myself and family will never any time soon set foot on a bus or train, i have two bikes only used in really good weather, but would never dare leave them in town.....so that only leaves car owners that are buying anything....who are yet again forced further out of town....if you own a shop/business in the town centre....i feel for you...its over, dead as a norwegian blue parrot and no one will come to your rescue....not many will remember but the centre was booming until the council introduced pay and display and closed off chapel st etc....the town needs to go back to how it was up to the late nineties...open up all the roads again to cars with free parking....the alternative is a bit frightening...boarded up shops, drug dealers on bikes, drunks and abusive beggars, and rough sleepers...but our local town managers seem to prefer this?

Originally Posted by salus.populi

A few cones and bollards is a drop in the ocean compared to the billions being frittered away by the government on contracts for inadequate or non-existent services awarded without any competition.

The public are being robbed blind.

A dose of whataboutery does not deflect from the central point.

Originally Posted by muddyboots

its irrelevant who is paying....its the damage to our town centre that is the problem...myself and family will never any time soon set foot on a bus or train, i have two bikes only used in really good weather, but would never dare leave them in town.....so that only leaves car owners that are buying anything....who are yet again forced further out of town....if you own a shop/business in the town centre....i feel for you...its over, dead as a norwegian blue parrot and no one will come to your rescue....not many will remember but the centre was booming until the council introduced pay and display and closed off chapel st etc....the town needs to go back to how it was up to the late nineties...open up all the roads again to cars with free parking....the alternative is a bit frightening...boarded up shops, drug dealers on bikes, drunks and abusive beggars, and rough sleepers...but our local town managers seem to prefer this?

Very well put, sadly the only people who know this aren't in power to do anything about it. The shoppers by car are being forced out of the town and sadly the ones who walk or go buy bike won't be able to buy enough to keep the current shops in business.

Originally Posted by muddyboots

its irrelevant who is paying....its the damage to our town centre that is the problem...myself and family will never any time soon set foot on a bus or train, i have two bikes only used in really good weather, but would never dare leave them in town.....so that only leaves car owners that are buying anything....who are yet again forced further out of town....if you own a shop/business in the town centre....i feel for you...its over, dead as a norwegian blue parrot and no one will come to your rescue....not many will remember but the centre was booming until the council introduced pay and display and closed off chapel st etc....the town needs to go back to how it was up to the late nineties...open up all the roads again to cars with free parking....the alternative is a bit frightening...boarded up shops, drug dealers on bikes, drunks and abusive beggars, and rough sleepers...but our local town managers seem to prefer this?

What is wrong with using buses and trains, a bike is probably as safe if not safer in the town centre as long as you use a decent lock but that applies everywhere. The Council was forced to introduce Pay n Display parking by the Government when Parking was decriminalised and they were given the responsibility for on street parking - it had to be self funding. Going back to the 70's, 80's or 90's the Town Centre was gridlocked with people occupying spaces at from 8-30 all day and on limited time parking getting caught by the Traffic Wardens. What is required is through traffic being moved off Lord St with the Pedestrianisation (except Buses etc) of the central section and a Bus / Rail interchange building with a relaunch of the Park n Ride from Fairways and Kew which should take in the Hospital.

Originally Posted by Alikado

What is wrong with using buses and trains, a bike is probably as safe if not safer in the town centre as long as you use a decent lock but that applies everywhere. The Council was forced to introduce Pay n Display parking by the Government when Parking was decriminalised and they were given the responsibility for on street parking - it had to be self funding. Going back to the 70's, 80's or 90's the Town Centre was gridlocked with people occupying spaces at from 8-30 all day and on limited time parking getting caught by the Traffic Wardens. What is required is through traffic being moved off Lord St with the Pedestrianisation (except Buses etc) of the central section and a Bus / Rail interchange building with a relaunch of the Park n Ride from Fairways and Kew which should take in the Hospital.

The people we need to attract don't in the majority uses buses or trains and they will just go elsewhere if we don't welcome them.

Park and ride is ok for events but not shopping.

Finding something to lock your bike to is a problem in the town centre I have experienced it many times.

When I do go on my bike i am in the absolute minority.

The town centre is too long to pedestrianise.

Originally Posted by local

The people we need to attract don't in the majority uses buses or trains and they will just go elsewhere if we don't welcome them.

Park and ride is ok for events but not shopping.

Finding something to lock your bike to is a problem in the town centre I have experienced it many times.

When I do go on my bike i am in the absolute minority.

The town centre is too long to pedestrianise.

People need change their habits to use Public Transport, in big cities it is a no no to use the car due to the cost of parking.
The Park n Ride is ideal for shopping the bus can drop you off and pick you up at any bus stop on the route.
There are plenty of purpose built cycle tethering points around the town and plenty of lamp posts and road signs as well.
not all the Town Centre needs to be Pedestrianised only the section of Lord St between The Monument & Eastbank St and London St to the Station.

It simply doesn't help telling people how they should shop and visit, they are the customers so we have to give them what they want.
Our town centre watched the customer's go to the retail parks mainly because of free and easy parking.

Originally Posted by local

It simply doesn't help telling people how they should shop and visit, they are the customers so we have to give them what they want.
Our town centre watched the customer's go to the retail parks mainly because of free and easy parking.

I agree with the first part of your comment, but not with the second.

Southport is predominantly Victorian and the buildings were designed for how people shopped then.
People go to the local retail parks because of the style of shop. Just a superstore like Tesco would have needed a major rebuild of the town centre. The units at Kew are things like Curry’s and Sofa shops, all of which need the space that the older shop buildings were never built for.

The other problem for town centre shopping (across the whole of the country) is internet shopping. The likes of Amazon operate on way less over heads (partly due to the way their taxes are paid). While it’s nice to shop locally, unfortunately shoppers will go for the cheaper on line prices.

(I know someone who’s idea of shopping is to go into town, find what she likes, try it on so she can see how it looks/fits and then goes and orders off line!)

Originally Posted by Alikado

What is wrong with using buses and trains, a bike is probably as safe if not safer in the town centre as long as you use a decent lock but that applies everywhere. The Council was forced to introduce Pay n Display parking by the Government when Parking was decriminalised and they were given the responsibility for on street parking - it had to be self funding. Going back to the 70's, 80's or 90's the Town Centre was gridlocked with people occupying spaces at from 8-30 all day and on limited time parking getting caught by the Traffic Wardens. What is required is through traffic being moved off Lord St with the Pedestrianisation (except Buses etc) of the central section and a Bus / Rail interchange building with a relaunch of the Park n Ride from Fairways and Kew which should take in the Hospital.

i see your point, but as you stated yourself the town centre was gridlocked in the past.....with shoppers!..the shops were packed out....you could only park free for 2/3 hours which is plenty of time...there was only a couple of decent lenient wardens that gave plenty of slack...as for park and ride its ludicrous....if you live in southport drive for 5/10 mins...then take a further 15 mins to get into town on a bus...but in present covid days none of us will get on a bus, train, or plane any time soon, we wont risk it....i respect anyone that does but please stay away from my family!, you now have a choice...embrace cars,,or find an alternative use for the town centre....seems the scarisbrick hotel is leading the way on this one

Originally Posted by Sap33

I agree with the first part of your comment, but not with the second.

Southport is predominantly Victorian and the buildings were designed for how people shopped then.
People go to the local retail parks because of the style of shop. Just a superstore like Tesco would have needed a major rebuild of the town centre. The units at Kew are things like Curry’s and Sofa shops, all of which need the space that the older shop buildings were never built for.

The other problem for town centre shopping (across the whole of the country) is internet shopping. The likes of Amazon operate on way less over heads (partly due to the way their taxes are paid). While it’s nice to shop locally, unfortunately shoppers will go for the cheaper on line prices.

(I know someone who’s idea of shopping is to go into town, find what she likes, try it on so she can see how it looks/fits and then goes and orders off line!)

southport has acres of dead space in the town centre,,,many empty unused useless gardens on lord street, very wide pavements full of nothing...look to other market towns like leamington spa, llandudno etc....every space is available for car parking and they are booming....what are we saving these spaces for?..skateboarders, tramps, chuggers, litter....amazon is booming because towns are penalising physical shoppers...time to fight back..

Originally Posted by muddyboots

southport has acres of dead space in the town centre,,,many empty unused useless gardens on lord street, very wide pavements full of nothing...look to other market towns like leamington spa, llandudno etc....every space is available for car parking and they are booming....what are we saving these spaces for?..skateboarders, tramps, chuggers, litter....amazon is booming because towns are penalising physical shoppers...time to fight back..

Do you really think that turning Lord Street into a car park, taking away one of the things that attracts people to Southport is a good idea???