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  1. sandGroundZero says:12/10/2020 12:51 PM
    silver fox says: "…Wage war against the private car and those drivers go elsewhere, …"
    — grossly overstates the impact of cycle lanes


    Sefton and other municipalities are implementing policies devised by central government. While I can appreciate that business proprietors are feeling anxious, singling out this Active Travel experiment is a psychological 'displacement activity'. The current threat to businesses' viability is undoubtedly SARS-Cov-2 restrictions.


    displacement — by Catherine Claire

    The notion that motorists are being persecuted is vaguely absurd. Businesses (and motorists) will adapt more-or-less depending upon their resilience in the face of troublesome restrictions and the longer-term difficulties posed to bricks & mortar retail, among others.

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  4. silver fox says:12/10/2020 02:35 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by sandGroundZero View Post
    silver fox says: "…Wage war against the private car and those drivers go elsewhere, …"
    — grossly overstates the impact of cycle lanes


    Sefton and other municipalities are implementing policies devised by central government. While I can appreciate that business proprietors are feeling anxious, singling out this Active Travel experiment is a psychological 'displacement activity'. The current threat to businesses' viability is undoubtedly SARS-Cov-2 restrictions.


    displacement — by Catherine Claire

    The notion that motorists are being persecuted is vaguely absurd. Businesses (and motorists) will adapt more-or-less depending upon their resilience in the face of troublesome restrictions and the longer-term difficulties posed to bricks & mortar retail, among others.
    Closing roads doesn’t sound like any attempt at creating a workable solution, who said car drivers are being persecuted? I said throw difficulties in the way and drivers go elsewhere, simple really.

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  6. local says:12/10/2020 03:29 PM
    It does appear the business communities problems are not something the selfish want to address.
    That's a shame.

  7. sandGroundZero says:12/10/2020 03:58 PM
    silver fox says: "…who said car drivers are being persecuted?"

    correction: The notion that war is being waged against motorists is utterly absurd!

    silver fox says: "Closing roads doesn’t sound like any attempt at creating a workable solution, …I said throw difficulties in the way and drivers go elsewhere, simple really."

    It is simple. Some (piqued, local) motorists may briefly choose to boycott town centre business owing to the loss of parking spaces on Hoghton St, plus limited access to Queens Rd. There will always be some whose nose is easily put out of joint.

    silver fox says: "…people coming into town from anywhere other than local, will use transport other than a bike, as often as not that will be by car."

    …and they will continue to do so, because Southport is worth a visit.

  8. Sap33 says:12/10/2020 04:14 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by silver fox View Post
    Closing roads doesn’t sound like any attempt at creating a workable solution, who said car drivers are being persecuted? I said throw difficulties in the way and drivers go elsewhere, simple really.
    Which roads are closed? Apart from Chapel street, which closed to traffic some time ago, there’s a few that have some restrictions, but that is all!

    There’s bigger things than a few restrictions that are affecting business in Southport, for example pandemics and internet shopping!

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  10. local says:12/10/2020 07:10 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Sap33 View Post
    Which roads are closed? Apart from Chapel street, which closed to traffic some time ago, there’s a few that have some restrictions, but that is all!

    There’s bigger things than a few restrictions that are affecting business in Southport, for example pandemics and internet shopping!
    You have pointed out some other pressures businesses are under couldn't you just accept that further avoidable restrictions on trade could be the straw that breaks many businesses.

    Why can you not be a little more understanding this is people's livelihoods and jobs, not a hobby.

    Just a few people a day struggling to park nearby and not going in could well be the end of quite a few jobs, people are really struggling.

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  12. lawed143 says:12/10/2020 07:34 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by local View Post
    Unfortunately, your puerile response overlooked the part where I pointed out I cycle.

    I wasn't complaining about the effects on me at all I was having some empathy for the local business owners.
    How often do you go into town shopping? If you genuinely want to support your local shops, you should do all your shopping in town, but I bet you don’t. All mouth.

  13. silver fox says:12/10/2020 08:58 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Sap33 View Post
    Which roads are closed? Apart from Chapel street, which closed to traffic some time ago, there’s a few that have some restrictions, but that is all!

    There’s bigger things than a few restrictions that are affecting business in Southport, for example pandemics and internet shopping!
    Of course there are problems for any high street, but I see little point in increasing those problems.

    How would describe Queens Rd with no entry signs at both ends?

  14. Sap33 says:12/10/2020 09:08 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by silver fox View Post
    Of course there are problems for any high street, but I see little point in increasing those problems.

    How would describe Queens Rd with no entry signs at both ends?
    Restricted! (Although you wouldn’t know they were there judging by how many ignore it!)

    It’s like that to try and channel motorists onto Albert Road. If you need to get to anywhere on Queens Road, the slightest of diversions eg Leyland Road will get you there!

  15. Sap33 says:12/10/2020 09:18 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by local View Post
    You have pointed out some other pressures businesses are under couldn't you just accept that further avoidable restrictions on trade could be the straw that breaks many businesses.

    Why can you not be a little more understanding this is people's livelihoods and jobs, not a hobby.

    Just a few people a day struggling to park nearby and not going in could well be the end of quite a few jobs, people are really struggling.
    If you read my other posts on this and other threads, I actually think that what’s been put on Hoghton Street is over the top! Most of the list spaces have been taken up by those wooden seating areas which allow some businesses to function (although that looks as if it’s been stymied!)

    The town centre was struggling before the cycle lanes and from speaking to more than a few shop keepers, their biggest problem seems to be from competition from the likes of Amazon, who are playing to a different set of rules.

    As for the patronising ‘you could be a bit more understanding’ comment, I cycle for commuting purposes AND to get into town to shop and support these businesses. (Before you ask how I manage, I use my car to do my weekly shop, usually in Asda or Morrison’s, where guess what, there’s ample parking for those who also want to get in to town!)

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