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Thread: Toby Young.

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by dav View Post
    The 4 schools Toby Young co-founded admit children with disabilities and also teach a higher than average number of poor kids (i.e. eligible for free school meals). Even a chippy socialist like trotty should see the virtue in that.
    Surely even a right-wing dimwit like Dav cannot continue to think a white supremacist with dodgy paedophile connections should be allowed anywhere near children.





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  3. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polly Trott View Post
    Surely even a right-wing dimwit like Dav cannot continue to think a white supremacist with dodgy paedophile connections should be allowed anywhere near children.
    Even unworthy of you, and that's saying something! "white supremacist" and the "paedophile connections" slur are simply irresponsible and libellous. Welcome to the online thuggery of the age of Corbyn. Socialism always ends badly - repressive, murderous, inhumane - as it did with the socialist rulers during the Third Reich and with your chum Trotsky and Stalin. Evil.

  4. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by dav View Post
    Even unworthy of you, and that's saying something! "white supremacist" and the "paedophile connections" slur are simply irresponsible and libellous. Welcome to the online thuggery of the age of Corbyn. Socialism always ends badly - repressive, murderous, inhumane - as it did with the socialist rulers during the Third Reich and with your chum Trotsky and Stalin. Evil.
    Which socialist rulers do you refer to in conection with the Third Reich? even you must know that Hitler and the Third Reich were the total opposite of any form of Socialism.

    Both Stalin and Hitler were dictators and frankly when it comes to dictators there are very few, if any benelovent dictatorships, alleged political leanings count for nothing when total control is the object.

    Online thuggery is a fairly recent downside to the WWW is not restricted to one political movement, race, colour or creed, no-one with any degree of democracy or fairness should agree with this sort of anonymous bullying.

  5. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by silver fox View Post
    Which socialist rulers do you refer to in conection with the Third Reich? even you must know that Hitler and the Third Reich were the total opposite of any form of Socialism.
    "We are Socialists, we are enemies of the capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions." - Adolf Hitler

  6. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by dav View Post
    "We are Socialists, we are enemies of the capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions." - Adolf Hitler
    That was part and parcel of the anti-Jewish propaganda, where Hitler blamed the (alleged Jewish) financiers as being responsible for Germany's economic situation, Nazi rule was Fascist in nature, certainly far removed from any form of democratic Socialism.

  7. #36
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    Quote
    "The claim that Hitler cannot really have been a socialist because he advocated and practised genocide suggests a monumental failure, then, in the historical memory. Only socialists in that age advocated or practised genocide, at least in Europe, and from the first years of his political career Hitler was proudly aware of the fact. Addressing his own party, the NSDAP, in Munich in August 1920, he pledged his faith in socialist-racialism: "If we are socialists, then we must definitely be anti-semites - and the opposite, in that case, is Materialism and Mammonism, which we seek to oppose." There was loud applause. Hitler went on: "How, as a socialist, can you not be an anti-semite?" The point was widely understood, and it is notable that no German socialist in the 1930s or earlier ever sought to deny Hitler's right to call himself a socialist on grounds of racial policy. In an age when the socialist tradition of genocide was familiar, that would have sounded merely absurd. The tradition, what is more, was unique. In the European century that began in the 1840s from Engels's article of 1849 down to the death of Hitler, everyone who advocated genocide called himself a socialist, and no exception has been found."


    http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-en...itler-and-the-
    socialist-dream-1186455.html

    Hitler rose to popularity through appealing to Socialist voters.
    Where his politics ended up is of less significance today than the rise of the 'regressive left'.

  8. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by dav View Post
    Even unworthy of you, and that's saying something! "white supremacist" and the "paedophile connections" slur are simply irresponsible and libellous. Welcome to the online thuggery of the age of Corbyn. Socialism always ends badly - repressive, murderous, inhumane - as it did with the socialist rulers during the Third Reich and with your chum Trotsky and Stalin. Evil.
    Iresponsible and libellous? We can all look forward to him successfully suing Private Eye then.

  9. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polly Trott View Post
    Iresponsible and libellous? We can all look forward to him successfully suing Private Eye then.
    Ah, yes, the paper of record.... Not a comic at all.

    Libel prosecutions are only for the mega rich. Toby isn't wealthy enough. Go on, trotty, set up a Go Fund Me for him. I know that you are interested in "fairness" and equal access to the law and all that....

  10. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamble View Post
    Quote
    "The claim that Hitler cannot really have been a socialist because he advocated and practised genocide suggests a monumental failure, then, in the historical memory. Only socialists in that age advocated or practised genocide, at least in Europe, and from the first years of his political career Hitler was proudly aware of the fact. Addressing his own party, the NSDAP, in Munich in August 1920, he pledged his faith in socialist-racialism: "If we are socialists, then we must definitely be anti-semites - and the opposite, in that case, is Materialism and Mammonism, which we seek to oppose." There was loud applause. Hitler went on: "How, as a socialist, can you not be an anti-semite?" The point was widely understood, and it is notable that no German socialist in the 1930s or earlier ever sought to deny Hitler's right to call himself a socialist on grounds of racial policy. In an age when the socialist tradition of genocide was familiar, that would have sounded merely absurd. The tradition, what is more, was unique. In the European century that began in the 1840s from Engels's article of 1849 down to the death of Hitler, everyone who advocated genocide called himself a socialist, and no exception has been found."


    http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-en...itler-and-the-
    socialist-dream-1186455.html

    Hitler rose to popularity through appealing to Socialist voters.
    Where his politics ended up is of less significance today than the rise of the 'regressive left'.
    So you think the British Empire was Socialist?

  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polly Trott View Post
    So you think the British Empire was Socialist?
    It was when the Labour Party was the incumbent government.

    The partition of India and Invasion of Iraq?

  12. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamble View Post
    It was when the Labour Party was the incumbent government.

    The partition of India and Invasion of Iraq?
    Not even close.

  13. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polly Trott View Post
    Not even close.
    It was a statement not a question.

    I am glad you returned.
    I forgot to mention.

    Chagos Islanders and Harold Wilson?

    No mass death but still not very socialist of him.

  14. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamble View Post
    It was a statement not a question.

    I am glad you returned.
    I forgot to mention.

    Chagos Islanders and Harold Wilson?

    No mass death but still not very socialist of him.
    How do you define Socialism? I know that for too many anyone with left of centre views is a closet Communist, that is not the case by a long way, the majority are concerned for their own country and countrymen, looking for a fair deal for all, have no more time for freeloaders than anyone else, incidentally freeloaders come from across the entire social spectrum, not as the Tories would have us believe just benefit claimants.

    It's all very well taking Hitler's old speeches and saying he was applauded by the meeting, seeing that this was a party meeting and he was the leader of that party hardly surprising, in very recent times we have seen some Tory or other stand in the House of Commons and announce another turn of the screw on public sector and/or benefit claimants and receive rapturous applause, only for the proposal to be quickly forgotten when it was realised that even their supporters in the electorate didn't like the proposal, just remember neither Hitler nor Stalin were subject to any control by the people.

    When it comes to cheap labour via immigration, I would imagine there is very little support among working people, which is probably how we got the Brexit vote.

  15. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamble View Post
    It was a statement not a question.

    I am glad you returned.
    I forgot to mention.

    Chagos Islanders and Harold Wilson?

    No mass death but still not very socialist of him.
    Yes an incorrect statement.

  16. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by silver fox View Post
    How do you define Socialism? I know that for too many anyone with left of centre views is a closet Communist, that is not the case by a long way, the majority are concerned for their own country and countrymen, looking for a fair deal for all, have no more time for freeloaders than anyone else, incidentally freeloaders come from across the entire social spectrum, not as the Tories would have us believe just benefit claimants.

    It's all very well taking Hitler's old speeches and saying he was applauded by the meeting, seeing that this was a party meeting and he was the leader of that party hardly surprising, in very recent times we have seen some Tory or other stand in the House of Commons and announce another turn of the screw on public sector and/or benefit claimants and receive rapturous applause, only for the proposal to be quickly forgotten when it was realised that even their supporters in the electorate didn't like the proposal, just remember neither Hitler nor Stalin were subject to any control by the people.

    When it comes to cheap labour via immigration, I would imagine there is very little support among working people, which is probably how we got the Brexit vote.
    'Socialism' in this context is in the spirit of your usage of 'Capitalism' which starts with a Labour government and hopes to avoid a far left one.

    I dispute your last comment.
    A Brexit vote was partly won due to the have nots in this country suffering more hardship and the reason they are suffering more
    being quite obvious to those who it pains to see the result.

    Much as I respect your opinion's I gather that you have not worked in any of the professions providing support to the vulnerable people in society who rely on a set of rules often enshrined in law which state
    priority in benefit of need.






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